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2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf

Posted by 3puttking 
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 02, 2014 09:24PM
.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/02/2014 09:26PM by SuperSheaps.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 02, 2014 09:26PM
ArcHyzer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> DING DING we have a winner!
>
> Let's not inform the Women's World Champion that
> her division isn't PDGA sanctioned.

Ouch. Seriously???
This could be the straw...
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 02, 2014 09:40PM
I entered a SN tournament that was also a PDGA tournament. Where are my scores/points on the PDGA board please?

Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 02, 2014 10:11PM
I may have missed it, but where was it states that this was a PDGA tournament for any division other than Pro Open and Advanced? I never thought my division was PDGA sanctioned or a USDGC qualifier based on the TD's decision.


Shane

Transparency of information breeds self correcting behavior!
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 02, 2014 10:27PM
Some people have nothing better to do than to find everything little thing to criticize. They forget that some people have lives. Great job Memphis and all the TDs who helped. Only issue I had was with the host hotel.

The Motel 6 across the street was $52 a night, and probably nicer as well. We had some serious issues with our room, but management at the hotel "tried" to help us fix the issues. I heard most people had good experiences with the hotel, but not us. Oh well!

Again, great job. The Beale street touch will never be forgotten. Great experience.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 02, 2014 10:53PM
Y'all really need to find something better to do the cry about every single thing. If you don't like the way SNC's are ran then step up and run it yourself.

Thanks J. Ray I had a blast in Memphis and look foward to playing another event of yours in the future.

It feels good to be off the Board.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 02:26AM
Eric Day Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Y'all really need to find something better to do
> the cry about every single thing. If you don't
> like the way SNC's are ran then step up and run it
> yourself.
>
> Thanks J. Ray I had a blast in Memphis and look
> foward to playing another event of yours in the
> future.
>

^ PREACH!
Does every tournament post results in just 2 days with 300+ players ? Jon Ray had to pull a temp course up re-install, pull 18 sleeves up fix that no wonder we are losing TDs give him some breathing room, Great job Jon Ray
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 08:01AM
shane Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I may have missed it, but where was it states that
> this was a PDGA tournament for any division other
> than Pro Open and Advanced? I never thought my
> division was PDGA sanctioned or a USDGC qualifier
> based on the TD's decision.
>
>
> Shane


You know what, this isn't so bad after all. The next time we run a SN tournament, we will just send in the fees from the open division only, since no one really cares about points right? Thanks for showing us how to get advertising for our tournaments for an 80% discount.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 11:11AM
I never stated that I agree with the decision, I just thought the TD was very clear about what was sanctioned and what was not. I have a feeling that Zack will take a different approach to next year's tournament.

I think that had some of these things been communicated early on in the process or even in the bid, people would have had time to discuss and move on. As it was, I think a lot of players were caught off guard. I was not even planning on playing in the tournament until a friend invited me on the 21st to come stay and play in the event. I read up on what was going on and decided I would have a good time anyway. So I may not be as upset as some who had been trying to have these issues resolved for a couple of weeks.


As for the USDGC spot, do I think that all Pro divisions should have had a chance to qualify while still playing for their divisions? Yes, but I knew going into the tournament that such would not be the case. Hopefully next year will return to the previous year's tradition on this matter for the SN. I was caught off guard in that I thought that the MS Rep spot was still for the Open part of the USDGC, not the performance division.

The one thing that I do not think we should be doing is crucifying TDs. It is hard enough to get people to volunteer to host these events. I would like to see some things done by the bod to help protect TDs and players. Payout schedules, when a TD should post minimum payouts, guidelines for how many rounds, USDGC spots, etc. could all be set by the bod and would provide transparency to the championships. This way TDs aren't taking a verbal beating about those topics, and players know what to expect from the event.

Shane

Transparency of information breeds self correcting behavior!
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 11:46AM
There aren't any TDs being crucified. People are properly pointing out that this TD felt he didn't owe the SN anything as far as following the past practices of all the previous SNPC events...which apparently he doesn't feel posting results is something he owes the SN either. The TD made a concious decision to do what he did and he's a big boy and doesn't need all of you making excuses for him.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 12:32PM
.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/2014 12:33PM by Bluff Magee.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 12:39PM
And just in case any of y'all want to keep claiming that the TD was "up front" about FPO, MPM and MPG being denied PDGA points, below is a post from a SN BoD director showing that at one time, the $10 non-PDGA member fee was being collected from divisions other than MPO and Advanced. Tim Hartline played Masters and at one point had to pony up an extra $10 as if it was a PDGA event for that division.

This isn't crucifying the TD, it is laying all the facts out in the open for everyone to judge for themselves.


cox3 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 19 entry fees were charged the $10 PDGA non-member
> fee before it was switched to no longer charging
> that fee.
> I have refunded 16 of those. The other 3
> individuals have not responded to my e-mail
> regarding the matter that was sent to the e-mail
> address they provided when registering. If you
> know how to contact these individuals, please let
> me know via private message. Thanks.
>
> Tim Hartline
> Robert Oliver
> Nick Bailey
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 12:59PM
This may be the most posted on thread in the history of S.N .344 and counting....

BMB
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 01:01PM
Which I believe was listed as a mistake and those people were refunded. I also do not agree with the decision to leave tradition, but at least from the time I entered to now, nothing changed. I was not told it would be PDGA, I was not charged $10, I was told that I would not qualify for the USDGC if I played Masters. I personally disagreed with all of those, but I knew where I stood. That could very well not be the case for others from your post Bluff.

Again, the BOD could help in a lot of areas to prevent these type of things in the future.

Shane

Transparency of information breeds self correcting behavior!
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 02:06PM
Great job by everyone, especially Jonathan. All courses looked fantastic!!! Best tournament by far I have played in and I have been at it for about 20 + years now. I usually do not post on stuff like this because most people that do comment just post negative stuff or are haters... But I can't just sit here and read this thread and let a few folks make it look as if it was a bad deal for everyone or something. It was a fantastic wekeened and took the plannig of many folks that took the time out of their busy schedule (including sacraficing disc golf rounds and being away from their families) to make this happen and from what I could tell it was a great time for most. And yes I did slaw out but oh well. If you don't like the way it was run step up and run it yourself... If you can't run it and don't like it don't play in it. I personally could care less abut PDGA points, like most of us I was there to have fun, see old friends and make new ones. If you playerd ams or advance you got your money back in the players pack and the last thing I want to do is donate 10 more dollars to the PDGA which I will never get back in any way, shape or form. Lastly like myself I want to say Jonathan does have a wife and kids and I bet now that this is over they might want to be selfish and have Jonathan for a few days to themselves. All socres were posted at Overton if you were there. Thanks again to all that made this happen.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 02:12PM
Hope its not off topic to put this here but just wanted to make sure you guys were aware that the 2014 SNC made it all the way down into the Jackson MS newspaper. Just a pick, no article, but at least it's something. I'd be curious to know who made that happen.

[www.kevindlewis.com]

While I'm at it I'll hit a few other topics.

PDGA sanctioning of the SNPC
I don't find any sanctioning requirements or prohibitions for any of the SNC's. It's up to the TD(s) what organization(s) if any to sanction the championships with.

Partial Sanctioning of SNQ's
I don't find a clear prohibition on this practice. 5.1 states that a "tournament" can be sanctioned. We don't really have a uniform definition of "tournament". We do have "5.1.2 $2 must be collected from each entrant", but if the TD declares one or more divisions to be in a separate tournament it seems the rule is literally satisfied. A SNQ TD can have multiple different tournaments intermingled at one time and place, some SNQ's, some not. I don't suggest many Tds will go for that since most players would like to have SNC qualification for $2.

Timeliness of results
We don't have a rule on this for the SNCs. We do have a "2 week" rule for the SNQs. "5.4.1.1 Tournament results are requested to be posted to the SN site or submitted to the SN for posting within 2 weeks following the event (minus any extenuating circumstances)." I've not yet met anyone who doesn't want quicker result posting other than the folks responsible for doing it who are still assimilating all the facts to be posted. I don't know why we should pressure SNC Tds to a shorter time.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 03, 2014 09:36PM
Bowling Green Am Championships had 697 players spread over 8 pools. They had results up each night by (3 day event). It can be done with the proper staff.

Locally, we had our results up on PDGA site each afternoon, although it was MUCH smaller (79)

It can be done, but it is a lot of work, especially when there are not enough volunteers and other things that have to be done. (if thats the case)

Perhaps the SN BOD members sent could be responsible for something like that? (just a suggestion) Maybe with the new website a easier way for TD's to add results could be created. I know how the SN Results system works, and only a select few can upload results, which takes time.

-will



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/2014 09:40PM by will2003.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 07:12AM
It doesn't really matter how any players you had, if you use the spreadsheet it should take you no more than 30 min to do results. And if you submit them in the proper format then board can just upload them straight to the site, but I will tell you when I was on the board not one single TD submitted their results properly.

Central Louisiana Disc Golf Association President
Ryan Niccolini PDGA#55907
niklpenny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It doesn't really matter how any players you had,
> if you use the spreadsheet it should take you no
> more than 30 min to do results. And if you submit
> them in the proper format then board can just
> upload them straight to the site, but I will tell
> you when I was on the board not one single TD
> submitted their results properly.


If 100% of the TDs failed to submit their results properly the fault was not with the TDs but with the Board.

Gary Wagoner
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 10:02AM
Zitto taking a bite from his disc.....Good Stuff!

BMB
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 06:29PM
Four days after the SN Championships and still only partial results? Well, I guess it's no sense beating that dead horse.

Since there's no results to look at and talk about how well some of our friends in Intermediate or Adv.Masters shot, maybe we could talk about the payout not meeting the SNPC guidelines found here: [www.sndg.org]

I mean I'd much rather be congratulating the players who cashed or won their respective divisions, but since I don't know who they were, why not talk about that payout?


Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 06:43PM
bluff you haven't talked about how anyone shot, or have you congratulated anyone, but when you do, you're going to start with ams and adv masters? Lol

How did you shoot? Barely miss that USCGC spot?
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 06:59PM
I'm not sure how far from the last USDGC spot I would have been, since I haven't seen anyone post who the 5 qualifiers were...but I would bet that I didn't barely miss it. Of course my division wasn't eligible anyway.

I've been in a terrible putting slump since the week before pro worlds so I didn't shoot great, but somehow managed to cash. It was satisfying going into the third round with everyone on my card being within one stroke of each other and playing for the last two cash spots and coming out ahead.

I'd like to re-iterate that I definitely appreciate all the volunteers who prepped the courses for this event. What bums me out is that Mr. Ray is saying that this tournament put Memphis on the map...but in all honesty, Memphis has been on the map for a long time, and his inability to get the scores posted for all the SN fans out there really is discrediting all the other work he did. I think it was cool that the putting contest was on Beale Street, but it's far more important for a CHAMPIONSHIP, the pinnacle of tournaments, to get its scores posted within 24 hours of its conclusion (and really most people would expect faster than that). I mean if this tournament was supposed to be putting disc golf in Memphis on the map, and sponsors come here looking for the results and here it is Thursday night and not all the results are up and the payouts not posted, and you had the women's World Champ there but you don't know what she shot this late in the week, I mean, would these sponsors really think that disc golf is a cutting edge professional sport?
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 07:01PM
I have maintained my composure for 9 months but this idiocy has to stop. Bernie, youre a freaking moron. You literally ran the worst SN Championships in history. That response came from people scattered all over the SN. Its idiocy like this that spews from the mouths of old grumpy @#$%& that runs every decent board member and TD off. We literally just ran the best SN Championships ever and the only ones @#$%& are the @#$%& that werent there. You guys cried like little girls and stayed home because you knew you werent good enough to compete and you wanted your cake and to eat it too. Shane Seal, i have the utmost respect for you and im sorry you got left out. You came and played knowing full well that you couldnt qualify in masters. You didnt agree with the decision but you came and played and honored the series and the tournament, yet you chose your division. I made a decision that most of you dont understand and im ok with that. I made it clear why i chose to do so. As far as the PDGA ratings go....if you werent aware this is the SN Championships. Why in the hell would we give the PDGA another $1000 for a rating that doesnt mean anything to our series or this championship (that was made clear from the very beginning of registration). The only reason we use a rating at this point is to qualify for the USDGC because its required to be a B tier. The same goes for the newly added USADGC (it must be a B tier). We dont want to deny our series these qualifications and the distinction of sending our players to the two biggest events in the world) and at the same time we dont want to pay the PDGA for no reason. The few of you that need to hear your own voices and cause drama need a reality check. What we need is for the Bernies, Buddys and other old cranky fools to get out of the way of progress. History should always be paid respect but we are in the fastest growing sport in the world and if we continue to stay in the dark ages with our website, lack of ratings, no member fee (number) and a board that turns over every 3 months because it is a thankless job that only gets to hear the pissing and moaning of the same 8 guys then this is going to die. Be a part of the solution and not the problem. You have literally run every great TD in this series off outside of Gardner. Get a clue. Results will be posted tomorrow.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/04/2014 07:03PM by 3puttking.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 07:32PM
Wow! So the SN only has one great TD left and that is Gardner? Sorry Zach and all the other people hosting SN events your efforts are for nothing according to mr. Ray. I can understand your rant till that last statement! SN has great TDs all over the place.

___________________________________________________________________________
Keith "Sunshine" B.
Rumble in Ragley, version 1.0
15 November 2014
Field limited to 90 players
[www.facebook.com]
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 07:37PM
The fact that that is what you drew from that post only magnifies my point Keith.
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 07:40PM
Maybe you missed the part where I said I can understand your rant.....

___________________________________________________________________________
Keith "Sunshine" B.
Rumble in Ragley, version 1.0
15 November 2014
Field limited to 90 players
[www.facebook.com]
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 07:51PM
Actually to sanction the other pro divisions with the PDGA would only cost about $400 not $1000.

There were like 18 masters.15 GM, and 7 pro ladies. Each player would cost $3 in fees ($120) then each non-PDGA member would be an extra $10. I count at least 12 current members off the top of my head (there's probably more but again, no scores posted to check). So that would be another $280.

Let me know if I can help you with any other math, like how the TD was supposed to pay out 125% of entry fees plus SN fees...like most previous SNPCs did. True, they didn't have a putting contest on a major street, I guess that is really what makes for a great tournament.

And with the time you used posting that rant you could have typed at least two divisions scores :)
Re: 2014 SOUTHERN NATIONALS PRO AND AM CHAMPIONSHIPS-presented by Grass Roots Disc Golf
September 04, 2014 07:59PM
Well Bluff youre wrong because we already paid for Pro open and advanced which would mean sanctioning the entire field. 306 x 3$ is 906$ (minus the 350 already paid for those two divisions). Then you add the non member fees which would have been at least half if not more of the field is $10 per person so in that instance it would be 150 x 10= $1500. Im guessing only one of us has a finance degree. The same @#$%& youre doing about this applies to the am field too. So then we have to go and sanction the entire field. So in essence youre taking at least $2k from the payout.
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