What's to assure me that no funny business will occur and all the low numbers will remain down there and the rest of us up here will be left with high numbers. Not that I'm saying that would happen.

Plus, a number of us have already indicated our desire to buy a tag. Actually, it probably numbers less than 10, but I could be wrong. If that's the case, I guess it would depend who gets a check there quicker or who uses a credit card.

Whatever Jim decides, I'll go with that. RWC

i think that jimo and willyBT will be fair about the distribution.

what they are proposing sounds fair... something like

city one - 1, 11, 21, 31 etc...

city two - 2, 12, 22, 32 etc...

city three - 3, 13, 23, 33 ad nauseum...

the cities that respond first and throw down the $ get the benefit of starting with the lower sets of numbers. first come first serve...

as far as the web site, i agree they should sell them thru skysouth.com or whatever-- but i bet ya that more will sell at tourneys than the web site will EVER sell...

not everyone is a computer geek. think of the (_!_)loads of folks that participate in SN tourneys-- compared to what-- a dozen or so of us here in this forum on a regular basis...

it would probably be wise to do both.... sell the tags at events and thru the website.

remember this is first and foremost a fundraiser... everything else is icing on the cake.

and what if, by buying a tag-- it introduces someone to their first SN event... there shouldn't really be restrictions on who can buy one... what if some texan just wants to purchase one to help out-- or something like that...

for instance-- i bought a Zboaz tag... no one around here has Zboaz tags... i just got one to help maceman with his fundraising efforts for course improvements at the Zboaz course over in little mexico. (but when some of them there texicans showed up for the LA OPEN i got to defend my Zboaz #45 against a guy that had #222)

these are just ideas and my opinions....
whatever JimO and WillyBT decide on is fine with me...

Actually, what Jim said is that they will be mixed up and 15 drawn for each city that wants tags. That sounds essentially random, which is probably better than doing 1,11,21, etc.

If a city wants 15, then 15 are randomly "drawn from a hat" and sent to them to be sold at the local tourneys. Next city to request gets 15 drawn from the hat. Random is good, in this case. As a result for my putting, random isn't so good. =8)

i like the tag rules, what will happen on the first 100 is they will be put in a bag and as they are ordered we will draw for them and send them to you ,if you are prsent when you buy them you will draw your own, as soon as the first hundred is sold we will order the next 100 . at least we have started the tag challenge.i would like to list somewhere on the site who has bought a tag .can we do that john. thanks jim

random sounds like a plan. as i mentioned, whatever SN folks decide on is just fine...

_________

Jimo, it might be wise to build a web page in SNDG.ORG that has the rules on it. Not everyone will "dig" thru this forum looking for the info that is deep in a thread...

Also if John needs help building a web page for the SNBTC i will gladly help out and build one... he can upload it or get me the FTP info and i'll upload it...

_________

i have a question... about rule #3
......

3. It is mandatory to accept challenges on the card at any
organized tournament. This includes all weekly/mini
tournaments as well as one day or two day tournaments.
If there are two or more tags present it is on. It is not
mandatory to accept a challenge from another card,
unless there is no tag on the card to challenge, then
that player must accept any challenge from another card.

.....

what if tag#9 is on a card, by himself

tag# 29 is on another card, by himself

tag #39 is on yet another card... all alone too...

according to Rule#3 if no other tag is on the same card, then it becomes mandatory to accept a challenge from some other card...

what if all three examples mentioned above are alone and player #9 is challenged by player #29 --- then later on in round two #39 wants in...

is it mandatory to accept all the challenges once a challenge had started?

it seems that it should be that player #9 would have to accept all the challenges from all the cards-- and the winner gets the low #

just curious what you folks think... and we ought to clarify things as best as we can before the SNBTC starts...


also, it is kind of a given, but challenges must be from the same set of tees... in other words sometimes Pros play the Pro tees while the Ams are on the AM tees (in second rounds at events)

i know these sound simple, but it may be wise to figure out situations before they occur...

_________

Yes, I like Mr. Jim's idea of randomly drawing the tags. This way everyone gets a fair shake at receiving a low # tag. I also agree that the tags should be sold at tourneys as well as on the internet, because like Vic said, not everone has access to the internet. Furthermore I think it is a good idea to not place restrictions on who can buy a tag. I say this because here in Hattiesburg we have a lot of casual players who are not quite ready to step up to "tournament player" status, as well as some "semi-retired" players who have'nt played in a tournament in a while. But they will still be willing to purchase a bag tag to help SNDG. Also, I think after some of our newer players get a taste of this "bag tag challenge" and see how fun it is to compete for something more than Sunday bragging rights, they will be more willing to play at the tournament lavel. Anyways, we need to remember that the main priority with this project is to raise money for the SNC, and not to worry so much about obtaining a lower tag #. Who cares who buys a tag, just as long as they are willing to help SNDG. Which brings up a good question. How would the SNDG community feel about people from long range areas purchasing a tag? The reason I am asking is because I am sure all my friends from back home (Columbus, GA) would be willing to purchase tags. Now I know this is a long ways off for people to realistically compete for their tags, but beleive it or not they do travel to quite a few SNDG tournaments. Anyhow, remember people, its about raising funds!!!! And this could mean selling about 10-15 more tags I guarantee. Let me know how some of you feel about this subject. Well back to business, Will or Mr. Jim you can send Hattiesburg's 15 tags to mine and Stephen's apartment when they are ready. Our address is:
Tony Bass
6490 US HWY 49N (Apt. 300)
Hattiesburg, MS 39401
Thanks alot, and speaking on behalf of the Hub City Sky Valet, we are very much looking forward to this taking off!!!

Sounds fair enough to me. I'll go with whatever Jim decides.

I guess it really doesn't matter when we send in the money, but once the tags arrive we need to decide when this will all begin.

I won't be able to approach any of the golfers up here until Sunday. Hopefully they will want to participate. Russ C.

All I know is that I had better get tag #1!!!!!
Even though I'll probobly loose it to a nov in my first toss w/ it. oh well.



It seems like we are going to keep it very simple this fledgling year, total braging rights and that's all.

The $ raised will go to the 2 SNDG championships, (percentage of # in each div, or what), but here in BR, we have BREC to do the course fixing up, so why take $ out of the BTC when BREC (suposidly) has new tee-signs, Concrete boxes, and a new course grant for us here in BR.


I'm still waiting for my #1 tag!

BTc

Will, if the disc golfer organizations also show a contribution of funds, it shows the other contributors (e.g., BREC) that we're serious about our sport and our courses, and not merely looking for handouts. A small contribution on our part can return even greater rewards. Think of it as an investment.

Take Scottlandville Park, for example. There's a lot of trash in the creek. When BREC pops the money for tee pads and baskets, we should organize and remove the 15 or so tires and the other trash that litters the creek, then pay to have it hauled away. Maybe pay to have a few foot bridges installed at strategic crossing points. As a whole, that's cheaper than putting in the entire course, but shows a strong committment on our part.

As an alternative, a certain percentage of the BTC$$ could be offered to the host club with one of two options. 1) Course improvements. If then club decides the course is in great shape, then 2) add it to the other BTC$$ already provided to increase the total purse.

Random thoughts from a fried brain...can't wait until Monday afternoon!

BTW, Jimo gets tag#1 and can NEVER lose it! =8)

in a years time (less) till the SN FINALS-- it is likely that participants will go thru quite a few tag #'s...

listening to the texican guys gripe and then brag and then gripe and then brag again as they go all over the Zboaz Bag Tag # "map" has been kinda funny.

i hope to randomly get #100 when they are initially handed out and work my way down... :^p


_____

just curious-- what about the female competitors that perhaps get a tag?

it seems something fair would need to be worked out... a handicap??

i'll ask the texicans to see how they handle that situation. i've never really heard of this issue brought up before in their forum...

Mrs. Goby is going to buy a tag. She's supportin' the SN.

other areas that have bag tag challenges are predominantly PDGA events in which PROS are always grouped together...

SN events -- in the first round, usually have a card that is mixed with many different divisions...

how will it work if a card has an AM and an ADV and an ADV MASTER and a PRO? (that all have bag tags)

it seems somehow unfair to the AM player to have to compete against "higher" divisions...

there are ADV and ADV MASTER and MASTER players that can perhaps compete at a level that they might have a gnats(_!_) chance of taking a tag from a pro-- but it seems unlikely that AM players or the female competitors that may purchase a tag will have any chance of being competitive enough with a PRO to defend a tag challenge...

just curious how it will work... it is likely to occur (mixed division challenges) so we should try to figure out a solution that is fair...

if the tags are randomly handed out and a AM ends up with #1 you know PROS will be interested in obtaining that tag...

any thoughts?

My thoughts once again....KEEP IT SIMPLE. This isn't kids soccer games in Maine were we play but don't keep score so there are no losers. This is DISC GOLF!!! I'm gonna kick your butt if I get the chance and pry your bag tag off your carcass unless you get in my head(Wally). Wait that's the sugar from the donut I ate talking, seriously I think the only division that should get a blanket handicap (to be determined) are the women, let the men from Am to Pro compete straight up, otherwise you'll end up with bag tags for each division, way to complicated and not as much fun. Besides I'm already playing against my division in the tournament. I think it's actually cool to compete outside your division in a tournament. I've got beat by all divisions during the first round of a tournament at one time or another. This will keep the more experienced players on their toes during that first round. From an Am or Advanced prospective I know when I first started playing I know the chances of beating a pro weren't great but I did it every once in a while. Imagine the smack talk when that am takes your bag tag!! You get better by playing better players (with me being the exception to the rule apparently) Anyway like I said - KEEP IT SIMPLE - this is for fun and bragging rights anyway. Later...
John K

the kiss principle is probably the best...

thats what i thought too, jk... let the guys go head to head regardless of division and keep it simple. but i was curious how other folks felt about it...

it seems like motivation for AMS... or, for other divisions to try and hang with a PRO in a BTC-- competitively speaking...

the texicans said they handle the women bag tag situation on a case by case basis and leave it up to each card.

they decided not to add anything to their "rules" concerning women.

with womenfolk golfers like des reading in texas, i guess so :^p
(she hung with willyBT, scorewise +/- at the USDGC... whew)

One possibility to would be to make same-card challenges optional instead of automatic in the first round. The challenge would exist only for those on the card who agree to accept, but no player is required to accept.

Another option is that challenges would be within divisions even in the first round. Prior to the start of the second round, all Ams (for example) would swap their tags according to the finishing order from the first round, then the challenge would be automatic in the second round.

Similar to above, the challenge is based on divisions for the entire tourney and tags are swapped according to final finishing order. 1st place in Am pool gets lowest number from Am player tags.

However....

It may actually not matter, and challenges can just be automatic regardless of the round. After the first tourney or two (and casual rounds), tags will tend to filter down by status anyway. Pros will accumulate lowest numbers, Pro Master and Advanced will get the next batch of low numbers, up through Am Men and Women having highest numbers. Thus, in the first round, a Pro will be more likely to have tag #6 and the Am on the card will be more likely to have #56. Thus, the Am will automatically be challenging the Pro for the low number. The Pro will smile graciously and say "Bring it on." Players closer in ability would probably want to challenge anyway.

A Pro (for example) who doesn't buy a tag until the second batch of 100 tags are issued, may have tag #106, and would automatically want to challenge everyone on the card to begin to lower his tag number. Thus, the Pro with #106 will be challening the Advanced player on the card with #34, the Am player with #56, and the Am Woman with #71. The likely finishing order would be Pro, Advanced, Am Man, Am Woman, so they would end up with tags #34, #56 and #71 and #107, respectively. But Advanced player (for example) may be having an off round and end up with #71 and Am Man gets #56.

Because tags will tend to filter by overall quality of play across multiple rounds and tourneys, I suspect that Pros and Advanced players will tend to be the prize winners for low tag numbers at the SN championships (assuming BTC prizes are indeed awarded). For everyone else, it doesn't really matter what tag number you end up with, beyond bragging rights. You're automatically a winner because you supported the SN by buying the tag in the first place! =8)

Personally, I'd say make same-card challenges automatic during tourney play for all rounds, then go out and have fun no matter how you fare.

(In other words, keep it simple. =8)

Oops, forgot to remove the missus from my name.

there ya go trying to take the cake for HER brilliance and simplicity...tsk, tsk tsk

I *am* shameless.

Just get me my tag!!!!!