Keith, this has nothing to do with the rest of the board as of now. I just wanted to get an idea on what the players and TD's felt. This info will be useful for when it's time to think about issues like ratings and new website. I would assume that the next board would handle these issues anyway, with there only being 3-4 meeting left for this board.
Jacob, we allow the TD's of our events to control the entry fee and payouts.
In that case, I am 100% against taxing the players anymore money to make up for the lack of effort by the BoD to find new streams of income/revenue. As a TD I would not collect anymore money from the players to pay SN other than the 2.00 per player already in place.
Keith "Sunshine" B.
"You are truly one miserable human being."
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2012 01:31PM by Keith Bodin.
i was saying this. Say a TD charges 25$ entry fee per player. obviously u take out 2$ for the SN fee and the rest goes to expenses and then the payout back to the players. I was saying instead of charge everyone an extra dollar or 2, just subtract the difference from the payout. It would just be less discs per tournament. And keep the entry fee at that 25$. Most players, well the ones i have met, dont care too much about more discs, they just play for the thrill of the game. Knowing exactly where the money went is also a bonus instead of seeing it disappear somewhere.
Keith Bodin Wrote:
> In that case, I am 100% against taxing the players
> anymore money to make up for the lack of effort by
> the BoD to find new streams of income/revenue. As
> a TD I would not collect anymore money from the
> players to pay SN other than the 2.00 per player
> already in place.
Thanks for answer Keith, shirts and bagtags have been used to boost SNC's leaving CFR disc as a good fundraiser. If you have any other ideas I'm more then happy to listen to them.
It's a lack of effort on the BoD. It's easy fix to say "just tax the players" If you think this is the right way to do thing you have a lot to learn....."just a dollar or 2 adds" up to over 10k a year from the players. JohnK has enough on his plate to deal with without adding another 10k to keep track of! Next yall are going to tell me I have to buy disc from the BoD to play in SN, but the BoD can buy their disc from anyone!
Why don't you, Mr. JBrowntown7, and Eric go out a find new sources of revenue to support the website and ratings ya'll are so cranked up about?
Keith "Sunshine" B.
Keith, this is the whole point of asking these questions ahead of time. If people want a new website, ratings or whatever else the money has to come from somewhere. You are against higher fee's and CFR's. Like I said if you have a better idea, please share it with us. Or you can run for BOD again if you wish to fix eveything yourself.
Where did I say I was against CRF? I never said I could fix anything.....Ratings are not a big deal to most players in SN. A new web site could be funded through other means.....I supported the shirts and most all major things and events in SN. I would also support a fund raising campaign for a new web site.
LET ME MAKE THIS EXTREMELY CLEAR. I AM AGAINST MONEY BEING TAXED TO THE PLAYERS WEATHER IT IS 1.00 OR 100.00.
Keith "Sunshine" B.
"You are truly one miserable human being."
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2012 02:21PM by Keith Bodin.
I am in agreement with Keith.... I work hard for mine...I been doing just fine for 10 plus years in the SN without a rating system...Think I can get by without it.. Should be optional to players if they want their ratings... especially if the only option was to charge them for the service.
My bad Keith read the part about CFR disc wrong, I was simply saying SN sell disc like we did shirts. Not force TD's to buy disc from us. So what if we did raise to $3, $2.25 went to the players div. and .75 went to the SN fund? This would add more money to the SNC's an allow the SN to do more things without the need of major sponsor money. It's not like we are "taxing" the players to stuff our pockets full of cash, it's to improve the SN.
If a new Website is ever started then website sponsors would be the way to go to keep it up and running.
I don't see why we would want ratings for AMs only? It wouldn't be that big of a price difference to give it to Pros also.
All SN money comes from and goes to the players in one way or another. You can have sponsors and dozens of fund raising campaigns but if it isn't spent on other things for the players it is spent on payout. That is actually a very good thing about the SN if you think about it. So how ratings would be funded is actually irrelevant. All that matters is cost and benefit, and that's why we don't already have ratings. The cost exceeds the benefit to most players, or at least that is the opinion of most of the Tds who are our gatekeepers.
No way will they want to keep a list of those who do or do not want a rated round
Remember there is also insurance for the tourney, more money to add up, water, food? support, sponsors, prizes, pencils ,board, need more help, where is all the cards, need more cowbell, I got a fever, it can be alot of little task/money that add up
Taking it out of payouts? Now just the winners are paying for it, others are getting a free ride, does not seem too diplomatic
I don't mind paying for ratings, so if someone wants to do the ratings, make it a service available and charghe those who want it,
PDGA ratings are fundamentally just averaged scores. Score averaging is as good a method as I have heard of, yet some still think that method is bogus or of little benefit. We should either put up or shut up and it's best done by TDs. I like Contrast's idea of giving SN TDs optional ratings for a dollar. It might not be an immediate best seller but could catch on. Make sure JK gets part of that dollar. Give it a trial period without division disqualification rules.
TD's are always looking for tournament sponsors. Does the BOD do the same with SN as a whole? Why not offer 3, 5, or 10 tournament sponsorship packages to businesses? You could let them select which group of tournaments they want to sponsor. That would easily bring in enough money to pay for a new website or anything else.
IF everyone was in agreement to do a rating system in the SN, how often would it be updated monthly, quarterly? With 8-12 events each month, it would be a huge undertaking to keep this updated. Also another job for TDs to pull this info for their tournies to make sure players were in the right division. OF course, I've never been to a PDGA event where someone looked at my rating after I signed up.
Eric Day Wrote:
> My bad Keith read the part about CFR disc wrong, I
> was simply saying SN sell disc like we did shirts.
> Not force TD's to buy disc from us. So what if we
> did raise to $3, $2.25 went to the players div.
> and .75 went to the SN fund? This would add more
> money to the SNC's an allow the SN to do more
> things without the need of major sponsor money.
> It's not like we are "taxing" the players to stuff
> our pockets full of cash, it's to improve the SN.
> If a new Website is ever started then website
> sponsors would be the way to go to keep it up and
> I don't see why we would want ratings for AMs
> only? It wouldn't be that big of a price
> difference to give it to Pros also.
Mainly because you would taking the money from only the AM's, but also because it's mainly the AM's wanting ratings to stop the "bagging"
Keep the fees the same. Instead of taxing more like a wanna-be socialist, the BoD only needs restructure how the income is distributed. Ratings can be had for a small price that wouldn't be noticed if the BoD would quit over-allocating funds to the SNAC where they are wasted every year.
Let's be honest...who wants ratings? AMATEURS want ratings. So let the small payment for ratings come from the SNAC funds.
Spending SNAC funds on ratings could still be an over-allocation if the benefit is less than the "small price". My guess is that it is only a minority of the Ams who want ratings bad enough to pay for them and most of those Ams would be disappointed with the anti-bagging impact.
Paying an extra dollar is not that big of a deal for an am. I'm in college and flat out broke and still dont see that as a big deal. And if they were disappointed about not being able to bag then it serves them right? THey shouldn't bag in the first place. Them being " disappointed " shouldn't be justifying no ratings
There are dozens of posts with people saying they want ratings And only like 6 or 7 ppl I've seen that just keep repeating others don't want ratings. Your right that more Ams may want ratings. But saying a minority want it to me is false
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2012 05:56PM by JBrowntown7.
I disagree Jazz. More ams want ratings than you realize. Don't take this the wrong way but you need to play in more events!
Ratings at the most should cost less than $20 a tournament, or around $2000 per year if there are about 100 SN events per year. Heck I think you Jazz would compute them for half that price. I know I will.