This thread wasn't started so people could calll out TDs they don't like, please refrain from do so. Tony Bass is my friend, if you don't like his events, don't attend them simple as that. Thankyou.

All valid points being made on thus thread and im cool with it as long as it dont mess up any payouts if the payout is correct for the $ put in and collected in entry fees i dont care if a Td makes some side cash these tournaments are hard to run and take time and effort to do :-) have a good day gentlemen :-)

There should be a set dollar amount for money collected from sponsorships and entry fees. Once a tournament director reaches that number, he could get a certain percentage of anything over that. Give him an incentive to find as much money as possible to put into the event.

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Justin Dyess

Overdrive Disc Golf
We buy and sell new and used discs. Check out our website.

Good idea Contrast! Does a TD influence you attending a tournament, even if some of your friends plan on going?

I wouldn't call even luxurious TD event accommodations profit but it is something for other potential TD's and players to consider. The SN needs motivated TD's and players. Just put the true facts out and players will do the figuring.

If there is not enough competition between TD's then maybe the fix is to reduce or eliminate the mileage protection. After all, SN marketing value alone is enough reason for a TD to sanction. The counter to TD greed is to be a non-greedy TD, a no-show or an elsewhere-show player.

Discjazz Wrote:
, I would
> suggest that we set a maximum retail price on the
> various types of payout plastic that can be
> charged without advance notice. That would allow
> players to know the money deal they are getting
> into without dictating the TD's finances or unduly
> discouraging SN sanctioning. While the SN is a
> great value a TD can have an event and make money
> on it without sanctioning.
>
> I also think there is enough difference between
> typical retail (even low side retail) and
> wholesale for a TD to make money without tapping
> into entry fees, sponsorships or tip jars. I've
> never made a dime personally as a TD but I'm not
> against it and our club has made money when I was
> the TD that the club later used to build, maintain
> and improve courses. I think that is the business
> model we should keep.


Great post...no more overpriced dx and pro plastic......nobody likes $20 pro plastic...unless it is 11x!

That's okay Brad! We saw who was the man and who was the little girl not long ago in Jackson.

I confronted Ms Girly and told him exactly what was going to happen to him when the tourney was over and guess what. He never even showed his face after the round. Went straight to the car and bolted back to wherever he calls home. I was waiting for him with bells on at the tourney HQ praying he would man up, but the little dude has no nuts!! What a SISSY!!! He talks a big game though, but couldn't fight his way out of a wet paper bag. Lol!! Punk!!

never mind.....

that comment would just stir crap!!!

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Keith "Sunshine" B



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2013 10:31PM by Keith Bodin.

I'm with ya Jazz! just didn't have the time to articulate as well!

Thanks Griff. Your agreement restores my world to order.

I also want to add that if a TD/Club does not have the assets to buy prizes for an event at or near wholesale consider two (2) possibilities. Sometimes you can deal straight with the major disc companies and if you time it right the event will be over, and money in the bank, before you actually have to pay the bill. Event stamped discs can actually be cheaper than stock. If you are not comfortable with a credit card float you might want to check with Jim Orum. He's been known to hook a club up for an event even if he can't be there, but of course I am not speaking for him or his current practices.

I don't think any td who asks for sponsors should be compensated for running an event. A high majority of sponsorship money sadly comes from disc golfers, I say sadly because players shouldn't have to give money to be able to win money (although this is the way is has to be for now). So why should a td make money off of an event players give money to? If a td takes what he puts in, I can understand, but if a td asks for sponsorship money, then his time and effort to run the tournament should be his/her sponsorship. Just my opinion, sorry if others disagree.

Terry Zeringue

If TD's were guaranteed a certain percentage of the money from each event, we'd see a much higher number of business sponsors than individual sponsors.

_______________________________________________________________
Justin Dyess

Overdrive Disc Golf
We buy and sell new and used discs. Check out our website.

So u are saying that the sport is being held back because TDs aren't guaranteed a certain % of money??

Terry Zeringue

Pretty much. Money is the best form of motivation. If TD's get a percentage of the event value, they'll put more work into sponsorship. They'll think of new sponsorship packages and different ways to advertise sponsors. They may even pass some of the money down by offering a finder's fee to anyone who brings them new sponsors. They'll brainstorm new ideas for increasing attendance. They'll experiment with different entry fees to figure out what brings in the most money.

Say a TD held a very good tournament last year. If he got a percentage for this year's tournament and it ended up being around $1,000, would you really be against it if in turn the event value were doubled or tripled?

_______________________________________________________________
Justin Dyess

Overdrive Disc Golf
We buy and sell new and used discs. Check out our website.

If the event value doubled or tripled, but that is not the case in most instances. If you have $1000 added cash and you put $1000 or more in your pocket, that is pretty much taking all of the sponsorship money. Its not just taking advantage of the players but taking advantage of the sponsors for your self. A TD should be out to make other people happy more than himself even if he has to make no money or maybe lose money to make sure that the event is good. The players or the sponsors should never be taken advantage of.

I'm sorry, but that's the equivalent of saying "nuh uh". Not the instance in most cases? When has a TD ever been given the incentive of a percentage of the event value for a SN tournament? And who said anything about a TD getting all of the added cash to event? I said a percentage of anything over a certain event value. For example...

Let's say the limit is $5,000 for a one course, one day tournament. If the event value is less than that, the TD gets nothing. For anything over that amount, the TD gets 10%. So if he adds another $1,000 to the event value, he is paid $100. If he gets the event value up to $10,000, he gets $500.

The numbers can be done differently, but the general idea is that the better job the TD does, the more he is rewarded. It's common sense that it will lead to better tournaments with higher payouts in my opinion.

_______________________________________________________________
Justin Dyess

Overdrive Disc Golf
We buy and sell new and used discs. Check out our website.

sorry contrast I over looked the percentage part of the last part of your comment lol

The SN rules include very little regulation of payout or other financial matters in a SNQ, and there is a good reason for that. I am not aware of any SN rule preventing a TD from taking whatever percentage or amount he wants. I do recommend advance disclosure.

Seems like the logical thing to do is make a rule:) LEt the TD make money. cool. BUT HAVE GUIDELINES AND RULES FOR IT. THanks

never really thought about it. the money isnt in winning the event. its in running it:) cool.

that statement and Obama will not rise taxes on the middle class belong in the same place!!!!


ESP Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> never really thought about it. the money isnt in
> winning the event. its in running it:) cool.

___________________________________________________________________________
Keith "Sunshine" B

It has been slightly discussed on the Boards private forum about Southern National Tournament Standards. I got pushed a side for a little while why we wrapped up some other topics.

If we get back on this topic what would you like to see set in place for SN Events?

Examples...
% of the field payout min. for non charity events
% of the field payout min. for charity events
% of entry fee's allowed to be taken out
Max. allowed money a T.D. can take out of an event
Allowed sale value of disc at pay out (Champ $16, Star $17..ect)
Bathrooms available on course.
Rule books for novice players

these...in order of importance:

Allowed sale value of disc at pay out (Champ $16, Star $17..ect)
% of entry fee's allowed to be taken out
% of the field payout min. for non charity events
Max. allowed money a T.D. can take out of an event
Bathrooms available on course.
Rule books for novice players

Some TD's mark discs up WAAAAYYYYY over suggested retail. I once received a $20 Pro Valkyrie. They are 10.99 all day 1/4 of a mile from my house. I drove 45 mins, paid $$$, played golf, and..bam. Really?!?

Turning down greedy TD SN fees is not good for the SN. All fees are good for the C's.

Exposing greedy TD's with actual facts is good. SN will get those fees from another event.

wayneacree Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> these...in order of importance:
>
> Allowed sale value of disc at pay out (Champ $16,
> Star $17..ect)
> % of entry fee's allowed to be taken out
> % of the field payout min. for non charity events
>
> Max. allowed money a T.D. can take out of an event
>
> Bathrooms available on course.
> Rule books for novice players
>
> Some TD's mark discs up WAAAAYYYYY over suggested
> retail. I once received a $20 Pro Valkyrie. They
> are 10.99 all day 1/4 of a mile from my house. I
> drove 45 mins, paid $$$, played golf, and..bam.
> Really?!?


I'm gonna take the other side of the issue and frame it this way. Wayne, you don't have to attend any tournaments. No one is forcing you. If you know the TD don't pay, then don't play.

Take the case of Bill. There's a few who like him and a few who don't. If the ones that don't just stay home, the ones that do like Bill will have more fun without the controversy. Pretty simple solution huh?

If you don't know the TD of an event, you don't have to play the first time he runs an event. Wait until you find out about what happened and then decide if you want to go back next year. Pretty simple solution huh?

Or, just go to any event expecting nothing. Expect your $30 or $40 to be like buying a ticket to a concert, and try to have fun like you're at a concert. Just don't pass the grass to Dustin during the guitar solo, dude.

Keith, lol!! I am now just trying to make people laugh at me being and idiot:) and ur statement is spot on:)

Its all good.....I know what we do here at LA Cote.

___________________________________________________________________________
Keith "Sunshine" B

yo KERNDOG on your last post = dude = last sentence - when i said guitar solo - i breathed in - and -- ((cough cough)) almost swallowed half a doobage LMMFAO peace dude

I think the SN website needs like and dislike check boxes for posts - with every log-on having just one choice per post.

It'd be a great way to REALLY see where the support is on the topics we kick around.......


THREAD DRIFT.......back to the diatribe....

I posted this in a different thread, but it seems relevant to gripes about payouts and TD's:

Seems to me the easiest way to avoid these scenarios is to post a payout sheet at ALL events.

Many of the events I've been to around the country have them and we do it at Circle 3 events in Memphis.

List all of the per player fees, show added cash in a different color and break down what divisions it went to and how much, and then show the per player cashout. It can be posted before the second round is over and then there are NO QUESTIONS. Players get an education on how many fees and expenses come with running an event, and the TD can field questions as to how much added cash was allocated to which division, but that would be the ONLY concern at that point.

Plus, the TD can still make money off of the difference between AM retail and wholesale on merch. Ideally, a club is making that money and it is funneled back into local courses or future events. But, if it is an individual who is making the profit, at least the payout is square and people will want to come back in the future.

Charity event, Club event, Solo TD event. Making money or not making money. Post it all up front and avoid all suspicion or drama.

Seems pretty clear. Standardizing it with a BOD decision seems like it will complicate it since not all TD's are created equal. Some don't want a dime and others advertise added money but it never seems to materialize. Mandating a posted payout sheet might be a way to ensure that players know what's up. It can keep things from either (a) appearing shady or (b) going that route... perhaps...