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Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more

Posted by niklpenny 
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 25, 2013 04:41PM
Pdga was around before SN was in the south. It must have died for some reason.

Terry Zeringue
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 26, 2013 06:00AM
SN is cheaper is the only reason I can think of.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 26, 2013 06:19AM
Really? So way back before no SN, a few ppl said "We want cheaper"?

Terry Zeringue
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 26, 2013 06:28AM
When Jim O started SN pdga headquarters was in toronto. Most big tournaments including worlds were in the northeast and out west. Most pdga members from this area didnt attend world championships so of all those pdga fees we paid very little of it ever came back. So Jim started SN as a way to have a championship that would keep our money closer to home and allow more players from the south to attend and have a chance to get their fees back instead of sending all of this money away and not seeing anything in return.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 26, 2013 11:40AM
SNs was Terry Resters brain child .... He liked the idea of a Southern series based from Mobile, which would end with a championship in "the city of chains" as he called Mobile. Rick Rothstien was in charge of membership and tourney fees for the PDGA, he and Terry had a HUGE argument and this inspired Terry to start SNs. He and Jim ran tourneys together and when Terry could no longer do so because of a job conflict, then Jim took up the torch and continued the series, At the start PDGA membership was only $25 dollars, as the Sn series grew the price of PDGA membership and fees skyrocketed, this would lead to more and more cities following the SN banner. In time, the SNCs started moving from city to city in the hope of uniting more cities and states, and as the PDGA became more expensive and less responsive to Southern disc golfers, the series became a rallying point for those who felt alienated and ignored. Those feelings remain for many, but a lot of the areas that helped start SNs have returned to Pdga control because they feel that in the end what the PDGA has to offer is worth the cost and is far and away beyond the scope of SNs. Whatever the future holds, there is a place for both organizations, depending on what you want from the game of disc golf, and you don't have choose between the two. MattiO is an excellent example of that, he built his game in the SN series and has now moved to the larger stage of the PDGA where he has done well. Pick your path and achieve your goals, but don't limit yourself by participating in only one of the series...... do your best to reach your full potential and enjoy what both have to offer YOU as your career unfolds. Buddy Pacatte PDGA#5996



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/26/2013 11:53AM by Flyerbud.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 26, 2013 02:02PM
Excellent history lesson and well spoken.
Thanks Buddy.

JABBA


it MUST be the plastic
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 26, 2013 02:07PM
dustin morris Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The reason the PDGA hasn't "Thrived" in the south,
> is because all you have seen in the past is SN...
> If all 8 of your events were pdga events, I am
> sure you wouldn't think twice about buying a
> membership. The $10 extra at sign up does suck,
> but that makes it easier for the players to get a
> membership because they don't want to pay it. The
> memberships allow them to have a paid staff. You
> are talking 14 cents a day or $5 a month for a
> membership. And you get stuff for signing up, so
> its not so bad.

not interested...unless a REALLY special tournament with a REALLY special payout. Not anything around here.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 27, 2013 06:54PM
A paid staff? Seems like the same "staff" that runs any tournament.

Terry Zeringue
Anonymous User
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 28, 2013 09:32PM
I'll continue buddy's history lesson...

2013

The SN still has the same website since it first originated and is now at an all time low for cities who run SN tournaments.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 29, 2013 09:44AM
wayneacree Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dustin morris Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The reason the PDGA hasn't "Thrived" in the
> south,
> > is because all you have seen in the past is
> SN...
> > If all 8 of your events were pdga events, I am
> > sure you wouldn't think twice about buying a
> > membership. The $10 extra at sign up does
> suck,
> > but that makes it easier for the players to get
> a
> > membership because they don't want to pay it.
> The
> > memberships allow them to have a paid staff.
> You
> > are talking 14 cents a day or $5 a month for a
> > membership. And you get stuff for signing up,
> so
> > its not so bad.
>
> not interested...unless a REALLY special
> tournament with a REALLY special payout. Not
> anything around here.


If we had a lot of PDGA members in our area, we would have a chance to have major pdga events. Alabama had a NT a few years ago...prolly a 5 or more hour drive for yall over there though. I like both series, but I know that the more money the series has, the better the series is going to be. I understand where you guys are coming from, but I just don't see an arguement on a $50 membership for an entire year if we had the events in our area. If 14-15 cents a day causes me to miss my bills, I will not be disc golfing. Everyone wants disc golf to grow, but they want everyone elses money to grow it.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 29, 2013 12:37PM
The PDGA is kicking right now... more tourneys than ever, ALL over the world!! Big money flowing into the events and to the players and Worlds filling up on just the invited players, and then there is the SNs, what Dillon said.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 29, 2013 01:55PM
> If we had a lot of PDGA members in our area, we
> would have a chance to have major pdga events.
> Alabama had a NT a few years ago...prolly a 5 or
> more hour drive for yall over there though. I
> like both series, but I know that the more money
> the series has, the better the series is going to
> be. I understand where you guys are coming from,
> but I just don't see an arguement on a $50
> membership for an entire year if we had the events
> in our area. If 14-15 cents a day causes me to
> miss my bills, I will not be disc golfing.
> Everyone wants disc golf to grow, but they want
> everyone elses money to grow it.

Has nothing to with bills, get over yourself. Your ego is showing.

Read the history of disc golf and why it was created and get back to me.

Disc golf
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 29, 2013 03:18PM
I don't think we need to delve into the beginnings of DG, or any other related sport here and this is serving only to derail the OP's origional topic.

some of this is being addressed in the new web page topic, I think there's enough folks that agree "something" should be done just not on how or why it should be done.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 29, 2013 04:19PM
wayneacree Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > If we had a lot of PDGA members in our area, we
> > would have a chance to have major pdga events.
>
> > Alabama had a NT a few years ago...prolly a 5
> or
> > more hour drive for yall over there though. I
> > like both series, but I know that the more
> money
> > the series has, the better the series is going
> to
> > be. I understand where you guys are coming
> from,
> > but I just don't see an arguement on a $50
> > membership for an entire year if we had the
> events
> > in our area. If 14-15 cents a day causes me to
> > miss my bills, I will not be disc golfing.
> > Everyone wants disc golf to grow, but they want
> > everyone elses money to grow it.
>
> Has nothing to with bills, get over yourself.
> Your ego is showing.
>
> Read the history of disc golf and why it was
> created and get back to me.
>
> Disc golf


Wayne, how do you think we should grow the sport or this series with the income that we have now? Everyone complains about money when it comes to pdga events and its just $50 more than SN and has more to offer. PDGA is growing the sport really well, so I will continue giving my $50 a year, even if I don't play an event all year.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 29, 2013 06:18PM
dustin morris Wrote:
-
> Wayne, how do you think we should grow the sport
> or this series with the income that we have now?
> Everyone complains about money when it comes to
> pdga events and its just $50 more than SN and has
> more to offer. PDGA is growing the sport really
> well, so I will continue giving my $50 a year,
> even if I don't play an event all year.


It(PDGA) does not have more to offer, that is YOUR opinion, and you are entitled to it. As far as donating $50 to a good cause, try a soup kitchen. It will get you a whole lot more satisfaction in the long run.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 06:30AM
wayneacree Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dustin morris Wrote:
> -
> > Wayne, how do you think we should grow the
> sport
> > or this series with the income that we have now?
>
> > Everyone complains about money when it comes to
> > pdga events and its just $50 more than SN and
> has
> > more to offer. PDGA is growing the sport
> really
> > well, so I will continue giving my $50 a year,
> > even if I don't play an event all year.
>
>
> It(PDGA) does not have more to offer, that is YOUR
> opinion, and you are entitled to it. As far as
> donating $50 to a good cause, try a soup kitchen.
> It will get you a whole lot more satisfaction in
> the long run.


Wayne, try answering the question I asked. PDGA 100% offers more than SN and grows the sport more. I also donate to many charities. Believe it or not, I am not a selfish person.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 08:39AM
What question? PDGA does not get my money because I choose to give my money to the less fortunate, not greedy corporations.

As far as I am concerned, the only problem with the SN are greedy TD's that OVERCHARGE to play in their tournaments.

POT of GOLD was $35...and is one of the BEST tournaments that I have ever played in.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 08:42AM
niklpenny Wrote:
> So if you don't like someone's idea, or think it's
> downright ridiculous, either post a better idea,
> or don't say anything at all
, Non-Idea comments
> only cause non-productive arguments, and deter
> from the actual constructive thought process,
> hindering free flow process
. If people are
> needlessly arguing, posting pointless personal
> attacks(causing defensive or counterattack
> statements), posting off topic, counter-intuitive,
> personal conversation or images/advertisements, it
> stops the group from focusing on the actual point
> and delay's new idea's from being posted, and can
> even discourage others from posting their Idea's,
> hindering the productivity.



Just to try to get "back on track" ... again. OP would like inptus "better ideas" and if you don't have a positive input ... no input is required, needed or wanted.

I know some of you just love derailing topic for the sake of derailing topics, especially if it's something you personally don't want or like but let's try to stick with the OP here.

Just sayn
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 09:30AM
wayneacree Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What question? PDGA does not get my money because
> I choose to give my money to the less fortunate,
> not greedy corporations.
>
> As far as I am concerned, the only problem with
> the SN are greedy TD's that OVERCHARGE to play in
> their tournaments.
>
> POT of GOLD was $35...and is one of the BEST
> tournaments that I have ever played in.

"Wayne, how do you think we should grow the sport or this series with the income that we have now?" < was the question. And to Joe Kool, me and wayne are discussing the "& more" portion of this topic. Me and Wayne may seem like we hate eachother on here but we just have beliefs that are different and we state our opinion because that is our right to. But if you would like me to talk about the other topics, I can.

Divisions:

Stop calling Intermediate, AMs. It causes great confusion to people and describes more than one division.

Baggers:

Impossible to stop but a way to have less baggers would possibly have a restriction based on your skill level some how (Ratings).

Championships:

We need to have more money for our championships so that we can have 3 very strong championships with less effort from the hosting cities (Memberships).

Bag tags are sort of like a membership but it doesn't really have that many positives. The raffle was a great motivation to have a bag tag but it has become now a hassle to get the tags. And unless you get on here, you would never know they even existed.

Please keep in mind that this will stir up issues to Joe Kool.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 02:13PM
The cost to play in sn championships are also far less expensive than to play in worlds. The series is for us players who love tournaments, competition, friendly atmosphere,,,, but whom are not out to live disc golf. I can not take off a week and travel all around the US to play worlds every year. It is more reasonable for me to play SN championships. I personally don't want the SN to mock or be anything like the pdga. I won't be playing in the LA States this year because I think it's rediculous for me to pay $10 extra dollars for me to play in my state's Championship just because it's pDGA sanctioned. What does that $10 do? Where does it go? Why does the pDGA need it? I know where my $2 goes and why it comes out of my entry, but not the $10. If I was more serious, and didn't have a family, and had a job that would let me travel, maybe i'd consider joining the pdga again, but for me the series I play in fits me perfectly. Is the series itself perfect? Nooooo, but that's where I fit.

Terry Zeringue
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 02:49PM
TheZinger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The cost to play in sn championships are also far
> less expensive than to play in worlds. The series
> is for us players who love tournaments,
> competition, friendly atmosphere,,,, but whom are
> not out to live disc golf. I can not take off a
> week and travel all around the US to play worlds
> every year. It is more reasonable for me to play
> SN championships. I personally don't want the SN
> to mock or be anything like the pdga. I won't be
> playing in the LA States this year because I think
> it's rediculous for me to pay $10 extra dollars
> for me to play in my state's Championship just
> because it's pDGA sanctioned. What does that $10
> do? Where does it go? Why does the pDGA need it?
> I know where my $2 goes and why it comes out of my
> entry, but not the $10. If I was more serious,
> and didn't have a family, and had a job that would
> let me travel, maybe i'd consider joining the pdga
> again, but for me the series I play in fits me
> perfectly. Is the series itself perfect? Nooooo,
> but that's where I fit.


But how can we grow the sport if everyone has the same mindset as you? Of course if SN took a membership, they would tell you where your membership money would go. But in order to have members, they would have to make it somewhat mandatory to have a membership. Kind of like the PDGA did. Do I know where that $10 is going for the nonmembership fee? No. But if you ask the right people, they will be able to tell you. If SN set up a non membership fee, they can make it well known where it is going. But to offer memberships with no perks is kind of pointless because no one will do it. My dad is a business owner, if he tried to do things that other businesses have never done it would probably work really well. But being that his type of business has been around so long, the likelyhood of him doing something that no one else has done is close to 0%. All I am saying, don't pass up a good idea, just because someone else came up with it. Even if it is a similiar organization.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 02:54PM
>
>
> But how can we grow the sport if everyone has the
> same mindset as you? Of course if SN took a
> membership, they would tell you where your
> membership money would go. But in order to have
> members, they would have to make it somewhat
> mandatory to have a membership. Kind of like the
> PDGA did. Do I know where that $10 is going for
> the nonmembership fee? No. But if you ask the
> right people, they will be able to tell you. If
> SN set up a non membership fee, they can make it
> well known where it is going. But to offer
> memberships with no perks is kind of pointless
> because no one will do it. My dad is a business
> owner, if he tried to do things that other
> businesses have never done it would probably work
> really well. But being that his type of business
> has been around so long, the likelyhood of him
> doing something that no one else has done is close
> to 0%. All I am saying, don't pass up a good
> idea, just because someone else came up with it.
> Even if it is a similiar organization.
Not everyone wants what you do, you have your PDGA, go play in it and leave this series alone. Why try to force people into your way of thinking...you have a choice, so use it. Pretty simple solution.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/30/2013 02:59PM by wayneacree.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 03:07PM
I like to throw my frisbee's, sometimes I throw with other people, sometimes we try and see who can hit the least amount of tree's, frisbee's like tree's, water is bad juju for frisbee, frisbee's are plastic and therefore are not drawn naturally to chains, I have to make my frisbee be friends with the basket, sometimes other people's frisbee's listen better than mine, but sometimes my frisbee doesn't hit the tree's, sometimes it goes right to the basket almost every hole, on the days were my frisbee is feeling compliant, sometimes other people's are not. I like those days, people give me more frisbee's and all other cool stuff on those days, and they even keep records of it, just for frisbee's doing what We tell em to do everyday. Each day is a new adventure for frisbee and me, will it fly crazy like a zig-zag bumblebee, or it will it hit the iron leaf of a singular tree, from grip lock to half cocked, from early release, to earthen tee's, there is one thing that is certain, at least it is for me. No matter the forum's and chats, no matter the baggers and rats, no matter the things people say you see, my frisbee is deaf, dumb and blind, and will remain drama free, in the end it be my plastic and me

Central Louisiana Disc Golf Association President
Ryan Niccolini PDGA#55907



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/30/2013 03:08PM by niklpenny.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 03:55PM
wayneacree Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > But how can we grow the sport if everyone has
> the
> > same mindset as you? Of course if SN took a
> > membership, they would tell you where your
> > membership money would go. But in order to
> have
> > members, they would have to make it somewhat
> > mandatory to have a membership. Kind of like
> the
> > PDGA did. Do I know where that $10 is going
> for
> > the nonmembership fee? No. But if you ask the
> > right people, they will be able to tell you.
> If
> > SN set up a non membership fee, they can make
> it
> > well known where it is going. But to offer
> > memberships with no perks is kind of pointless
> > because no one will do it. My dad is a
> business
> > owner, if he tried to do things that other
> > businesses have never done it would probably
> work
> > really well. But being that his type of
> business
> > has been around so long, the likelyhood of him
> > doing something that no one else has done is
> close
> > to 0%. All I am saying, don't pass up a good
> > idea, just because someone else came up with it.
>
> > Even if it is a similiar organization.
> Not everyone wants what you do, you have your
> PDGA, go play in it and leave this series alone.
> Why try to force people into your way of
> thinking...you have a choice, so use it. Pretty
> simple solution.


I have to drive hours to get to one. So I try to work with SN. Everyone should want SN to improve, and to do that SN might have to make similiar steps as PDGA did to make it better. A More competitive generation is coming up and its going to happen regardless. Its just a matter of time before either SN improves or SN gets over run by pdga events. You even see it happening where you are at.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 03:57PM
niklpenny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I like to throw my frisbee's, sometimes I throw
> with other people, sometimes we try and see who
> can hit the least amount of tree's, frisbee's like
> tree's, water is bad juju for frisbee, frisbee's
> are plastic and therefore are not drawn naturally
> to chains, I have to make my frisbee be friends
> with the basket, sometimes other people's
> frisbee's listen better than mine, but sometimes
> my frisbee doesn't hit the tree's, sometimes it
> goes right to the basket almost every hole, on the
> days were my frisbee is feeling compliant,
> sometimes other people's are not. I like those
> days, people give me more frisbee's and all other
> cool stuff on those days, and they even keep
> records of it, just for frisbee's doing what We
> tell em to do everyday. Each day is a new
> adventure for frisbee and me, will it fly crazy
> like a zig-zag bumblebee, or it will it hit the
> iron leaf of a singular tree, from grip lock to
> half cocked, from early release, to earthen tee's,
> there is one thing that is certain, at least it is
> for me. No matter the forum's and chats, no matter
> the baggers and rats, no matter the things people
> say you see, my frisbee is deaf, dumb and blind,
> and will remain drama free, in the end it be my
> plastic and me



"I would actually like to hear what some of the players, and some of the tournament directors out there think:
Maybe we can come up with some great ideas via collective brainstorming if we can follow this process flow."
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 05:11PM
>
> I have to drive hours to get to one. So I try to
> work with SN. Everyone should want SN to improve,
> and to do that SN might have to make similiar
> steps as PDGA did to make it better. A More
> competitive generation is coming up and its going
> to happen regardless. Its just a matter of time
> before either SN improves or SN gets over run by
> pdga events. You even see it happening where you
> are at.
No I don't, the PDGA is not doing as well in Memphis as you think. It is like you are trying to convert people to your religion, not everyone believes as you do...like I stated in my previous post.. Don't think that it is going to happen regardless....that is delusional thinking at best. There are TONS of players that refuse to renew their PDGA membership...why? NO BENEFITS to normal people. Leave things alone and go your own way.
Travel the world, win a couple of A tiers, and then you can preach the benefits of the pdga(small letters on purpose).
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 05:33PM
There IS a reason the SN is growing and a reason the SN was started. Getting run over by the pdga? What are you talking about? I could go to a SN tournament almost every weekend that's within a 3-4 hr drive from me. The best of the best from the SN go to big pDGA tournaments. We all root for them. It's like a family, not a nationwide organization.

My city has a league, $2 out of the entry gets taken out, $1 goes to the club, the other $1 goes to the rolling ace pot. Would I like more people to show up? Yes. But I don't have to run it like the pDGA, nor do I want my city's league to compete with the pDGA. The SN is sorta like that. It's a league/series that spans 8+ states.

"Have you ever played in a tournament? No you say? We are hosting a tournament in 2 week, you should come check it out and play. Since you haven't played in a tournament, you can play novice. How much you ask? $15......oh, but if you are not a pDGA member it'll be $25 just to see what a tournament feels like. You don't want to pay the extra $10 just to see what a tournament is? Well you can join this organization for $50/year."

Terry Zeringue
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
April 30, 2013 06:13PM
My first. Tournament was a PDGA event, got my membership and all before the tourney, I cashed that one, it was great, I don't think there is an extra fee for novice players in the PDGA, it's the same price as most sun tournaments. The argument between two organizations is ridiculous, one of them is the world wide standard for international tournaments, and the other one is a pretty much a public league, which sometimes acts as a farm club. If playin tournaments and hangin with friends maybe drinking a couple is your thing, then you have a home for life, but if your ambition is to be a world class player, and play majors, well then consider this minor leagues on your to being called up

Central Louisiana Disc Golf Association President
Ryan Niccolini PDGA#55907
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
May 01, 2013 06:24AM
Zinger, do you think that SN is to its full potential? If not, how can we make this series better? Will it cost money that SN doesn't have? All I am saying is we need a source of income that will cover all of these improvements without taking away from tournaments and our championships. The reason I said over run by pdga tournaments is because 3 or 4 years ago, we never thought of hosting pdga events.

Wayne, its nothing like religion. I like both sanctioning bodies. I am not pushing anyone to pdga, I am just saying lets improve this series so that everyone can enjoy this series to the full.
Re: Divisions, Baggers, Championships, & more
May 01, 2013 09:01AM
TheZinger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There IS a reason the SN is growing and a reason
> the SN was started. Getting run over by the pdga?
> What are you talking about? I could go to a SN
> tournament almost every weekend that's within a
> 3-4 hr drive from me.
The best of the best from
> the SN go to big pDGA tournaments. We all root for
> them. It's like a family, not a nationwide
> organization.
>
> My city has a league, $2 out of the entry gets
> taken out, $1 goes to the club, the other $1 goes
> to the rolling ace pot. Would I like more people
> to show up? Yes. But I don't have to run it like
> the pDGA, nor do I want my city's league to
> compete with the pDGA. The SN is sorta like that.
> It's a league/series that spans 8+ states.
>
> "Have you ever played in a tournament? No you say?
> We are hosting a tournament in 2 week, you should
> come check it out and play. Since you haven't
> played in a tournament, you can play novice. How
> much you ask? $15......oh, but if you are not a
> pDGA member it'll be $25 just to see what a
> tournament feels like. You don't want to pay the
> extra $10 just to see what a tournament is? Well
> you can join this organization for $50/year."


But you've played in 2 tournaments all season? 2 of the guys arguing the most for things to stay the same have 4 tournaments between them. I think I understand now. Dustin and I have played around 16 tournaments between us and many of the more active tournament players I've talked to would like to see ... something ... to make a few changes to keep folks from playing(bagging) in divisions below their skill level. Does SN need a $40 or $50 annual membership ... NO. BUT I don't think a $1 added to the $2 fees to work on a few things like a wholly owned SN website, better online features, an actual webmaster AND RATINGS are very much needed in a lot of peoples eyes.
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